Why Hoboken is Better Than Brooklyn
Kathy Zucker and her family took a trip back to Brooklyn Heights. They retraced their steps and found the place unchanged; they were the ones who had changed.
Photos
My husband and I recently took our two toddlers to the Brooklyn Marriott to watch the NYC Fencing World Cup. into many of our old teammates and introduced them to our children.
We parked our car in Brooklyn Heights, our former neighborhood. After we left the fencing salle, my husband had the brilliant idea of getting dinner there and revisiting our favorite haunts. We had already stopped by the farmers' market to pick up lunch materials, and the food was just as great as we remembered.
Everywhere around us were families out on weekend walks, it was the perfect setting for a Brooklyn Heights toddler outing on a gorgeous summer evening. And yet we couldn't wait to get back to Hoboken.
After dinner we strolled down the promenade, stopping to sit on a park bench, looking at the Manhattan skyline from the east side. Every step we took in Brooklyn ignited old memories. We stopped to get ice cream and ate it on a stoop. We also had the thrill of seeing two FDNY trucks tear out of the fire house down the block.
I expected to be overcome with nostalgia and longing to live in Brooklyn Heights again. And it is certainly an incredibly picturesque, walkable, convenient area. It is also old, something that never occurred to me while we were living there. Almost every building has steps in front of it, a nightmare when you are hauling a heavy double stroller. Parking garages are scarce and on the outskirts of town, window air conditioning units are the norm, and the sidewalks were bumpy with ancient tree roots.
Some parts of Hoboken remind me of Brooklyn Heights, but there is much more new construction, especially on the west side of town. My family has an urban lifestyle 15 minutes from Manhattan with many of the benefits of the suburbs (expansive rooms, deeded garage parking and central air conditioning plus big box grocery stores with parking). I knew all this when I bought my condos, but re-experiencing my past brought those choices back vividly.
I am really glad we chose to live in Hoboken.
To read more about what makes Kathy Zucker tick, check out her blog at http://hobokenmomcondo.com/momblog and follow her at http://twitter.com/zhobokenmom
Kathy Zucker
2:22 pm on Friday, July 2, 2010
Note: Hoboken is much, much cheaper than Brooklyn, especially Brooklyn Heights. A condo similar to the one I currently own would cost twice as much, not to mention the out-of-control parking, grocery bills and private school costs (google St. Ann's).
Kathy Zucker
4:41 pm on Friday, July 2, 2010
A reader emailed me questioning my sanity to compare Hoboken favorably to Brooklyn. Here is my response:
I go back to Brooklyn pretty frequently, my parents still live in Bay Ridge and my sister is in Park Slope. Yes, the property taxes are very high in NJ, about double what they are in NYC. But we get an income tax break in NJ (30% in NJ for state & federal vs. 40% in NY for federal, state & city). Groceries and sales tax are much lower, schools are better and cheaper, altogether the cost of living is much lower in Hoboken than in Brooklyn.
Houses in Bay Ridge start around $900k, and they are old, needing a lot of work. Meanwhile I can get a new construction condo in Hoboken for about $700k. Park Slope is about 1.5x Hoboken and Brooklyn Heights is 2x.
Believe me, if I could replicate my current lifestyle in Brooklyn, I would be there in a heartbeat. But I can't, so for that reason alone Hoboken is better.
Have a nice 4th of July!
Kathy Zucker
12:50 am on Saturday, July 3, 2010
Incredibly timely NYTimes article calculating the cost of raising a family in Brooklyn vs. NJ suburbs. Bklyn family pays 21% more income tax. http://nyti.ms/a2bCmN
Indiecom
9:21 pm on Tuesday, July 6, 2010
jesus christ - thing is - Hoboken isn't the suburbs - that pseudo-suburbanish crap on the west side of Hoboken is the worst thing in town. I'll never understand why people who obviously like the suburbs and want the things that the suburbs have to "offer" don't just simply move to the suburbs.
Kathy Zucker
10:27 pm on Tuesday, July 6, 2010
Hmm, reasons not to move to the suburbs. Long commutes? The need to drive everywhere? Yard work? Nothing to do but go to the mall?
My kids each have their own bedrooms in Hoboken (my daughter's room is 300 square feet), my husband has a 35 minute commute, and it's so much cheaper than Brooklyn that we can manage on one income. What's not to like?
Wilfred Joseph
10:26 pm on Friday, November 19, 2010
Kathy you must be young and have some bias against “old”. You keep mentioning that the places like Brooklyn Heights and park Slope and bay ridge have "old things", houses, garages, sidewalks etc. I must remind you that “old” has character, old means that it has withstood the test of time; it is now valuable and some times wise. In furniture, cars jewelry we pay some of the highest prices for “old” things. Those new constructed buildings in Hoboken are not up to the same quality the buildings in Brooklyn Heights. As they say "they don't make it like that anymore".
Hoboken is one square mile and even with the new construction and garages it still is as impossible to park as Brooklyn Heights. I lived in Hoboken from 1983-1987. I moved there from the Heights the parking was impossible. I went to school at night and experienced some of the worst parking nightmares after 11PM. I finally gave up and moved to Jersey City where I had my own parking space and garden. Living there taught me one thing though -how to create parking spaces where there are none.
Kathy Zucker
10:44 pm on Friday, November 19, 2010
Wilfred,
My childhood best friend and I both grew up in 100 year old+ Brooklyn houses. There are definitely some upsides to older homes, like solid iron bathtubs and plaster walls. However, both our parents had to do significant work on the homes every year because they were old. Nonstandard door sizes, sloping floors because one side of the house had settled lower than the other, leaky radiators, and crumbling brickwork were standard fare in my childhood. I hope that my 3.5 year old condo makes it to that age, but I don't miss the constant and expensive repairs or the sky-high utility bills from ancient and inadequate insulation.
Parking is definitely not easy in Hoboken, and it is getting worse over time. However, Brooklyn is harder. There are very few parking garages; the ones in Brooklyn Heights are all on the outskirts, so it is standard to have to walk 5-10 blocks to and from your garage. I cannot even imagine trying that with small children; grocery shopping must be a nightmare. Hoboken and Jersey City parking are pretty comparable; not sure what things were like in the 1980s but I have always had my own parking spot in the three different places we have lived in Hoboken.
Wilfred Joseph
11:48 am on Saturday, November 20, 2010
Thanks for your reply. I see that you are convinced that Hoboken is better than Brooklyn. And I guess in many regards you are. You have an easy commute NYC, PATH or ferry; you see the NYC skyline better than most of Brooklyn; and you live in a town that reportedly has the most bars per square mile and can party hearty. I will concede to you on those points, but regarding the housing stock, no. Many of the houses in Brooklyn are almost 200 years old. If you have a Brownstone in the Heights or any place else that has those beautiful brownstones, those walls are so thick that even without insulation they are well insulated. What has to happen in any old house is that every so often the systems have to be upgraded. High utility bills come from many things including poor windows and an old heating system. To compare an apt with R30 insulation in the walls and new low E windows, brand new HVAC system with an apartment with rickety windows and 30-40 year low efficiency heating systems, then of course they will have to spend more for heating and maintenance.
If you are to compare a renovated old house with a brand new apt on Hoboken the Old House will win.
But if compare neighborhoods, the beauty of those old houses, with tree lined a streets and the character of a neighborhood, Brooklyn can’t be beat.
Kathy Zucker
12:27 pm on Saturday, November 20, 2010
There are incredibly picturesque areas to both Brooklyn and Hoboken, as well as unattractive industrial areas. It's very difficult to compare a one-square mile area to an 80-square mile one. Ultimately beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
I miss Brooklyn terribly and would love to live there. But it comes down to affordability and convenience. I need short commute, dedicated parking, and low costs.
Renovated brownstones in Bay Ridge, Park Slope and Brooklyn Heights cost well over $1 million, closer to $2 million or $3 million. There is no way my family could afford that. Even with higher property taxes, Hoboken is much more affordable. You can buy an 1,800 sf 3-bedroom condo with parking for about $650k. Monthly maintenance in the low $400 range, property taxes around $9k/year. There is no comparison. And schools in Brooklyn are much, much more worse. There are not many good public schools and the private ones are incredibly expensive ($30k/year for grade school).
For a young family, yes, Hoboken beats Brooklyn Height, Park Slope and Bay Ridge for affordability, convenience and amenities. That is why we are here.